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Balkinization Symposiums: A Continuing List                                                                E-mail: Jack Balkin: jackbalkin at yahoo.com Bruce Ackerman bruce.ackerman at yale.edu Ian Ayres ian.ayres at yale.edu Corey Brettschneider corey_brettschneider at brown.edu Mary Dudziak mary.l.dudziak at emory.edu Joey Fishkin joey.fishkin at gmail.com Heather Gerken heather.gerken at yale.edu Abbe Gluck abbe.gluck at yale.edu Mark Graber mgraber at law.umaryland.edu Stephen Griffin sgriffin at tulane.edu Jonathan Hafetz jonathan.hafetz at shu.edu Jeremy Kessler jkessler at law.columbia.edu Andrew Koppelman akoppelman at law.northwestern.edu Marty Lederman msl46 at law.georgetown.edu Sanford Levinson slevinson at law.utexas.edu David Luban david.luban at gmail.com Gerard Magliocca gmaglioc at iupui.edu Jason Mazzone mazzonej at illinois.edu Linda McClain lmcclain at bu.edu John Mikhail mikhail at law.georgetown.edu Frank Pasquale pasquale.frank at gmail.com Nate Persily npersily at gmail.com Michael Stokes Paulsen michaelstokespaulsen at gmail.com Deborah Pearlstein dpearlst at yu.edu Rick Pildes rick.pildes at nyu.edu David Pozen dpozen at law.columbia.edu Richard Primus raprimus at umich.edu K. Sabeel Rahmansabeel.rahman at brooklaw.edu Alice Ristroph alice.ristroph at shu.edu Neil Siegel siegel at law.duke.edu David Super david.super at law.georgetown.edu Brian Tamanaha btamanaha at wulaw.wustl.edu Nelson Tebbe nelson.tebbe at brooklaw.edu Mark Tushnet mtushnet at law.harvard.edu Adam Winkler winkler at ucla.edu Compendium of posts on Hobby Lobby and related cases The Anti-Torture Memos: Balkinization Posts on Torture, Interrogation, Detention, War Powers, and OLC The Anti-Torture Memos (arranged by topic) Recent Posts Beware the "Augmented" McCain Amendment!
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Saturday, October 15, 2005
Beware the "Augmented" McCain Amendment!
Marty Lederman
The Conference Committee that will consider and reconcile the Senate and House defense appropriations bills is scheduled to meet this coming week. The Senate bill contains the "McCain Amendment," which would prohibit all U.S. personnel from engaging in cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment of detainees -- i.e., engaging in conduct that would "shock the conscience" under Due Process Clause doctrine -- anywhere in the world.
Comments:
Professor Lederman, your blogs on U.S. policy with regard to humane treatment of detainees have been an immense service to our country and to human decency. In a noble cause, they combine crucial information, clear reasoning and passionate concern. Many thanks, and please stay on the case! Posted 10/15/05
Professor Lederman, your blogs on U.S. policy with regard to humane treatment of detainees have been an immense service to our country and to human decency. In a noble cause, they combine crucial information, clear reasoning and passionate concern. Many thanks, and please stay on the case! Posted 10/15/05
Let me second that: you've done some really fine work on this topic Marty, and please keep it up.
But there is one thing missing from this analyis, and from the general debate: 18 USC 2441 (War crimes), the War Crimes Act of 1996 and Expanded War Crimes Act of 1997. Any grave breach of Geneva, any violation of Geneva Common Article 3, or any violation of the Hague IV (1907) Annnex of Regulation Concering the Laws and Customs of Land Warfare arts. 23, 25, 27 or 28 is a federal felony whenever such an act is committed by or against a US national or service member anywhere in the world. The Geneva Conventions are non-derogable for the duration of hostilities, there is no staute of limitations, and war crimes exclude any form of immunity. The Bush administration is already guilty of literally thousands of counts, their "interpretations" of the laws are patently fraudulent, and their current efforts are just further evidence of their already fully obvious crimes. Any member of Congress who votes to authorize those crimes will themselves be guilty of violating 18 USC 2441 -- in fact, I believe there is already probable cause to believe that Senators Stevens, Cornyn, and Sessions (among others) are actively aiding and abetting those crimes. This administration and the party that that spawned it are an absolute disgrace to our nation. There is only one real issue here, and indeed, only one real issue in US politics and law: defending the Constituion of the United States and making sure that these outrageous criminals are punished to the full extent of the law for their crimes -- even if it takes 30 years or more to do it. Regards, Charles Gittings PEGC //http://pegc.no-ip.info/
I believe Mr. Gittings is on the mark. I don't know how we can restore decency after the Bush regime without accountability and severe punishment. Such as been the success of the Neocons' propaganda campaign to ingrain a nihilistic relativism in the public that I would go further and say that some sort of national Truth Commission (or soul-searching -- to include the heart with the brain) is crucial if we hope to reverse our plunge into barbarism and divisiveness.
Marty Lederman is as usual right on target in assessing the threat of the Stevens "augmentation" and the considerations that lurk behind it. We should all keep in mind that, even though the public eye has been kept focused on Abu Ghraib and various courtmartials coming out of it, the most serious abuses have consistently been linked to CIA and special forces operatives. A large part of the uniformed military's problem has related to CIA techniques which have "migrated." Indeed, even the recent account provided by Capt Ian Fishback about the 82d Airborne at Camp Mercury shows that the most abusive techniques were "taught" by CIA and special ops forces. Acceptance of the Stevens amendment is acceptance of torture as an officially sanctioned US practice. This must be vigorously opposed.
I can hardly bear to read this - it makes me sick to my stomach -- waterboarding? live burial?
What kind of people do this? The Bush administration is dragging America into slime, turning the shining city on the hill into a cesspool. What you have become is a tragedy for the world.
what baddies? The US war on 'terra' is, at least in major part, a myth promulgated by the neocons to ensure perpetual war and, eventually, perpetual fascism. If it were not for peak oil and the location of most of the remaining oil in the world, we wouldn't be in Iraq nor salivating about Iran. I cannot wonder that much of the world regards the US as its enemy now or to be. And the fact that we torture folks -- and kill them in detention makes me ashamed to be American and ashamed for America. We can be tough and committed without torturing and without sinking into fascism. But will we? Not if the neocons and corporatists remain in power. And frankly, there is little opposing them right now. So you are probably witnessing the end of the America that was decent and worthy of admiration and the beginning of the abomination, the American Empire.
Basic point of military history: if your enemy is willing to go to lengths that you aren't, you may be in for a badass wake-up call.
I don't see how that 'basic point,' if it is one, applies here. Flying planes into buildings is one extreme length to go to, torture is an entirely different one. They're apples and oranges. I support shooting down a plane on its way into the (occupied) Capitol or the Sears Tower, or turning Afghanistan upside down to wreck AQ infrastructure. There's no need to support torture to keep a retaliatory arrow in your quiver, if that's your concern.
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