Balkinization

Say It Ain't So, Colin

ABC News reports that "In dozens of top-secret talks and meetings in the White House, the most senior Bush administration officials discussed and approved specific details of how high-value al Qaeda suspects would be interrogated by the Central Intelligence Agency."

Highly placed sources said a handful of top advisers signed off on how the CIA would interrogate top al Qaeda suspects -- whether they would be slapped, pushed, deprived of sleep or subjected to simulated drowning, called waterboarding.

The high-level discussions about these "enhanced interrogation techniques" were so detailed, these sources said, some of the interrogation sessions were almost choreographed -- down to the number of times CIA agents could use a specific tactic.

The advisers were members of the National Security Council's Principals Committee, a select group of senior officials who met frequently to advise President Bush on issues of national security policy.

At the time, the Principals Committee included Vice President Cheney, former National Security Advisor Condoleezza Rice, Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld and Secretary of State Colin Powell, as well as CIA Director George Tenet and Attorney General John Ashcroft.

So now the plot thickens. John Ashcroft, it appears, repeatedly signed off on the legality of the techniques but was squeamish about going into details, arguing "that senior White House advisers should not be involved in the grim details of interrogations." "According to a top official, Ashcroft asked aloud after one meeting: `Why are we talking about this in the White House? History will not judge this kindly.'"

Moreover, the committee's approvals, it appears, continued even after Jack Goldsmith disavowed the Yoo torture memos:

[T]he CIA had captured a new al Qaeda suspect in Asia. Sources said CIA officials that summer returned to the Principals Committee for approval to continue using certain "enhanced interrogation techniques."

Then-National Security Advisor Rice, sources said, was decisive. Despite growing policy concerns -- shared by Powell -- that the program was harming the image of the United States abroad, sources say she did not back down, telling the CIA: "This is your baby. Go do it."

Posted 10:15 PM by JB [link]

Comments:

The question is no longer who knew and approved of the CIA interrogation program, but rather who did not? It appears that even the "squeamish" in the Executive and Congress signed off on the program.

# posted by

Bart DePalma : 11:19 PM

Appalling. Again.
Supposing they imagined themselves to be Saving Civilization, what can their idea of civilization be?

# posted by

felix culpa : 11:26 PM

1000 years of torture in Iraq! McCain-Rice '08!

# posted by

Matt : 11:28 PM

Appalling.

There are no words.

# posted by

Seth : 11:41 PM

So, Colin Powell was in the meetings where the interrogation methods were discussed and approved. How does this account square with Powell's later outrage over the torture (see his 9/13/06 letter to Sen. McCain)? If he had such concerns about the conduct at the time, why not take a forceful stand? Attempt to block the implementation, resign and draw media attention to the matter, etc.

I suppose this does explain the mystery as to why there wasn't a greater pushback from with State and others within the government. Up until know, we assumed that Yoo was able to implement all of these policies because of his friendship with Addington, Gonzales, and Haynes. But if Rice (and tacitly Powell) signed off as well, that would give the interrogation program almost complete cover. Absolutely amazing.

# posted by

Land : 12:08 AM

All of the above-named officials are criminals and all of them should be in jail.
I'm curious as to how Ashcroft, supposedly a deeply religious man, justified his part in this.

# posted by

Rich : 12:08 AM

Having read the ABC article, I confess I'm worried on placing too much reliance on anonymous sources. I suspect this "principals group" had a fluctuating attendance and I suspect that the most egregious stuff might have been reserved for days when State was not in attendance. All the disclosed material suggests the Cheney/Rumsfeld Axis were pro and State was sidelined.

# posted by

Mourad : 12:30 AM

Saw that article in a comment on Greenwald's blog. Sick, sick, sick.

My comments on it (including Ashcroft's somber assessment) here. Who would ever have thought that Mr. "Cover up the tits of Ms. Liberty" Ashcroft would prove to be the least crazy (see also the hospital room incident) of the cabal.....

Oh, and I'm guessing, based on this, that when Rice and her husband get it on, she's the "top"....

Cheers,

# posted by

Arne Langsetmo : 12:43 AM

It appears that even the "squeamish" in the Executive and Congress signed off on the program.

"[S]queamish" here is used in a relative way.

Cheers,

# posted by

Arne Langsetmo : 12:46 AM

Land:

But if Rice (and tacitly Powell) signed off as well, that would give the interrogation program almost complete cover.

Powell was not Rice's boss. Powell has his own actions to answer for, but Rice was accountable only to herself and Dubya here.

Say, anyone hear that the conservatives are drooling over the prospect of Rice as Veep candidate?

Cheers,

# posted by

Arne Langsetmo : 12:50 AM

The question is no longer who knew and approved of the CIA interrogation program, but rather who did not? It appears that even the "squeamish" in the Executive and Congress signed off on the program.

Must be an interesting life, waffling between "no evidence" and "too much evidence."

# posted by

Eric : 5:56 AM

Further on

"The question is no longer who knew and approved of the CIA interrogation program, but rather who did not? It appears that even the 'squeamish' in the Executive and Congress signed off on the program."

"That's old news." Which is dismissive of truth. Why remember the Alamo, Pearl Harbor, My Lai, 9/11, Abu Graib, etc? Just look forward, forget the past. What was Satchel Paige's advice? "Don't look back, they may be catching up to you." But this isn't a sport, or is it for some?

# posted by

Shag from Brookline : 8:39 AM

Another casualty of the Bush Syndicate is Powell's political career.

# posted by

Mr.Poindexter : 8:57 AM

Having read the ABC article, I confess I'm worried on placing too much reliance on anonymous sources

Greenburg was praised on the "conservative" side of the fence for her Supreme Court reporting; I think she's pretty credible. Certainly, she could not afford for this story to blow up in her face, like the McCain lobbyist-or-girlfriend? story in the NYT.

ABC also scooped the waterboarding of KSM -- they have connections somewhere.

# posted by

Anderson : 9:09 AM

More on sourcing -- speculation from Laura Rozen about John Kiriakou, who

had a window into who in the Principals' meetings signed off on what. And to be rankled by the White House and Congress tendency later to put responsibility for those decisions all on the CIA.

Not entirely grammatical, but suggestive. Certainly, the trend of the article is to argue that CIA did "everything it could" to make sure it had cover ... if you leave out having its own counsel provide independent scrutiny of the relevant laws, that is.

# posted by

Anderson : 9:41 AM

'Oh, and I'm guessing, based on this, that when Rice and her husband get it on, she's the "top"....'

Rice has never married.

# posted by

billposer : 6:26 PM

'Oh, and I'm guessing, based on this, that when Rice and her husband get it on, she's the "top"....'

Rice has never married.

Condoleeza Rice at one point slipped and referred to George Bush as her "husband" before correcting herself. IOW, Arne is being sardonic here.

# posted by

Enlightened Layperson : 7:06 PM

It is most revealing that the image of Condi as the "rational" counterweight to the OVP mob has been steadily eroding, not only from her disastrous role as NS Advisor, but also as SecState, where her "peace initiative" posturing vis-a-vis Israeli-Palistinian conflict is juxtaposed to the virulent anti-Hamas
efforts of the Abrams/Drayton group, machinations to which she signed off.
If we really had a vigourous press in the US, Rice's well-cultivated imagery should have long before been exposed as the fraud that she is...pathetic.

# posted by

Archimedes39 : 12:59 PM